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 Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem

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Lokki
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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Tue Sep 26, 2017 10:39 pm

@IowaSteeler927 wrote:


Man Buddha where the heck is that guy? Need his sense of humor back!

I miss Buddha. He was my partner in crime back on SF. We trolled so well together. The Herd!!

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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Tue Sep 26, 2017 11:23 pm

Yeah AV is a great front for the franchise:

Alejandro Villanueva drives beat-up truck, studies business at Carnegie Mellon

PITTSBURGH -- Alejandro Villanueva is driving NFL headlines for unintentionally standing alone, hand over heart, during Sunday's national anthem while his team remained in the tunnel. Villanueva's status as a former Army Ranger who toured in Afghanistan has been well-documented this week.

But in the Steelers' locker room, he's known as a "Big Al," an affable 6-foot-9 left tackle who carpools to work.

Time for a new ride: Villanueva drives a brown Ford F-150 with tape around a dented bumper and the number 78 in tape on the rear window.

http://www.espn.com/blog/pittsburgh-steelers/post/_/id/25303/alejandro-villanueva-drives-beat-up-truck-studies-business-at-carnegie-mellon
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effyou515



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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 1:05 am

ok, the way I see it Trump is playing the playbook of a CEO got the NFL owners players in unison in a protest now fellow Americans how do we correct this problem?

???????????????????????????????????????????????????????

https://pics.onsizzle.com/not-sure-if-eagles-players-were-protesting-erato-ade-33-3909070.png

Quote :
In April of 2000, Myron Piggie, a former convicted felon turned nationally prominent AAU basketball coach, was indicted on 11 counts of fraud by the United States Attorney for the Western District of Missouri.
Piggie was charged with essentially the same crimes that rocked college basketball Tuesday. Ten men, including college assistants, a travel club coach, a financial planner, agents and shoe executives were arrested after a two-year FBI investigation, the U.S. Attorney in Manhattan announced.
At the heart of both cases were payments to top high school players from shoe companies (then Nike, now Adidas) and agents that were designed to steer them to favorable colleges before later getting them to sign with the same shoe companies, agents and financial planners when they reached the NBA.

imo Trumps statement about firing the SOBs who didn't stand for the anthem, was how did you get where you are?

college amateur athletics is dirty maybe the gov'mt is trying to clean it up?

the NFL owners with their Billion dollar investment are locked hand in hand with the players because they don't want change?

throw a couple of bucks to the black family, or a wealthy white family adopt a very athletic black child.

ever try to bet high school football game? it's hard as fuck.

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solardave

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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 5:20 am

My older brother ( some of you know how old I am and might think this is impossible) who is much smarter than me posted this article :

https://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2017/09/26/open-letter-to-nfl-players-youre-being-used/

I think it makes perfect sense.
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stlrtruck

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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 10:13 am

@solardave wrote:
My older brother ( some of you know how old I am and might think this is impossible) who is much smarter than me posted this article :

https://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2017/09/26/open-letter-to-nfl-players-youre-being-used/

I think it makes perfect sense.

So nice, I posted the link on my FB page.

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Wallace108

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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 10:57 am

@solardave wrote:
My older brother ( some of you know how old I am and might think this is impossible) who is much smarter than me posted this article :

https://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2017/09/26/open-letter-to-nfl-players-youre-being-used/

I think it makes perfect sense.

Your brother says some unpopular things. But truth isn't always popular. He said a lot of things I agree with, and a few things I'm not sure about. I need to digest it a little more.

In the meantime, here's an article I believe everyone, regardless of their views, should read.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/ask-matt-labash-how-to-make-peace-over-trump-and-the-nfl-kneelers/article/2009833

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solardave

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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 2:42 pm

@Wallace108 wrote:
@solardave wrote:
My older brother ( some of you know how old I am and might think this is impossible) who is much smarter than me posted this article :

https://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2017/09/26/open-letter-to-nfl-players-youre-being-used/

I think it makes perfect sense.

Your brother says some unpopular things. But truth isn't always popular. He said a lot of things I agree with, and a few things I'm not sure about. I need to digest it a little more.

In the meantime, here's an article I believe everyone, regardless of their views, should read.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/ask-matt-labash-how-to-make-peace-over-trump-and-the-nfl-kneelers/article/2009833

Good post Wally. I think that in this information age we live in this information comes at us as fast or faster than we like and it makes it all the harder to think it through. And no matter which side of the fence we're on we still have to decide if what the "free press " prints is true.

The movie Absence of Malice with Paul Newman and Sally Field was a prime example of what the press is willing to do to sell papers. If you ever watched it you know Newman used their lack of integrity against them. A lot of people bash Trump for being on Twitter. This is the first time in my life that I've seen a US president be attacked relentlessly. Off of the top of my head I've been around for 13 of them. Yet because he fires back in real time a lot of people have their panties in a wad. If these people of the press can take pot shots then they should be ready for the recoil. Like the man said..."it's his right to be an asshole". Whether he should or shouldn't is debatable.
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BKAnthem



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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 3:52 pm

@solardave wrote:
My older brother ( some of you know how old I am and might think this is impossible) who is much smarter than me posted this article :

https://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2017/09/26/open-letter-to-nfl-players-youre-being-used/

I think it makes perfect sense.

This is written by someone who has no idea of the Grassroots work,( with Money donated By CK himself ) to combat all the problems he wrote about. the Literacy Programs, Job Training and placement, anti gang initiatives...etc.... I wish these guys would take the time to actually get on the ground and actually see this work being done instead of going off media propoganda, and creating ill informed Blogs. Right now a lifelong friend of my is spearheading an event called "24 Hours of Peace" in Newark NJ, for the 2nd year in a row, and was even interviewed on ESPN NY about it this past week. that your Big Bro doesn't know about this doesn't surprise me.

This article reads like a Fox News Hit piece, the Police Departments around the country are supposed to Protect and serve ALL people, not cherry pick who they are going to Pull over, who gets approached with Gun Drawn, Who gets shot without provocation over who gets Negotiated with for Hours and Hours, while actually holding a weapon and waving it at police.

Former Tennis Star James Blake was Slammed to the ground and arrested standing in front of a hotel he was staying in, Eric Garner was choked Illegally and died for selling bootleg cigarettes, which should have gotten him a ticket at most. Walter Scott was shot in the back several times while running away from a police officer, Laquan Macdonald was Shot 16 times, 15 of those after he was already on the ground from the first shot, and officers lied and said he lunged at them with a knife( lucky the dash cam was on this time)...and these are a few examples of Brutality CK protests, when in all honesty 1 should be to many, My commissioner always tells us as law enforcement we have to hold ourselves to a higher standard, shouldn't that also include uses of force? I mean Black people vote, pay taxes, and work ( yes, even in the DANGEROUS inner cities ) like very one else.

That's the Brutality the CK is protesting, that's why he kneels, Peacefully and non-violently, and excersing his constitutional rights...never once saying he was protesting the flag or the military....Only that Brutality and threat of it, which is something some of you guys will never experience and don't even try to empathize with ...and that is so Pathetic to me
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IowaSteeler927

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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 5:32 pm

@BKAnthem wrote:
@solardave wrote:
My older brother ( some of you know how old I am and might think this is impossible) who is much smarter than me posted this article :

https://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2017/09/26/open-letter-to-nfl-players-youre-being-used/

I think it makes perfect sense.

This is written by someone who has no idea of the Grassroots work,( with Money donated By CK himself ) to combat all the problems he wrote about. the Literacy Programs, Job Training and placement, anti gang initiatives...etc.... I wish these guys would take the time to actually get on the ground and actually see this work being done instead of going off media propoganda, and creating ill informed Blogs. Right now a  lifelong friend of my is spearheading an event called "24 Hours of Peace" in Newark NJ, for the 2nd year in a row, and  was even interviewed on ESPN NY about it this past week. that your Big Bro doesn't know about this doesn't surprise me.

This article reads like a Fox News Hit piece, the Police Departments around the country are supposed to Protect and serve ALL people, not cherry pick who they are going to Pull over, who gets approached with Gun Drawn, Who gets shot without provocation over who gets Negotiated with for Hours and Hours, while actually holding a weapon and waving it at police.

Former Tennis Star James Blake was Slammed to the ground and arrested standing in front of a hotel he was staying in, Eric Garner was choked Illegally and died for selling bootleg cigarettes, which should have gotten him a ticket at most. Walter Scott was shot in the back  several times while running away from a police officer, Laquan Macdonald was Shot 16 times, 15 of those after he was already on the ground from the first shot, and officers lied and said he lunged at them with a knife( lucky the dash cam was on this time)...and these are a few examples of Brutality CK protests, when in all honesty 1 should be to many, My commissioner always tells us as law enforcement we have to hold ourselves to a higher standard, shouldn't that also include uses of force? I mean Black people vote, pay taxes, and work ( yes, even in the DANGEROUS inner cities ) like very one else.

That's the Brutality the CK is protesting, that's why he kneels, Peacefully and non-violently, and excersing his constitutional rights...never once saying he was protesting the flag or the military....Only that Brutality and threat of it, which is something some of you guys will never experience and don't even try to empathize with ...and that is so Pathetic to me

That "brutality" you speak of isn't as prevalent an issue as you make it out to be. I agree, law enforcement can always do better, but they aren't out there gunning down black people at an exponential rate, versus the amount of whites/hispanics/asians they use deadly force against. That is a myth perpetuated by people like Kaepernick, and by Liberal media oulets like CNN.

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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 5:42 pm

@IowaSteeler927 wrote:
@BKAnthem wrote:
@solardave wrote:
My older brother ( some of you know how old I am and might think this is impossible) who is much smarter than me posted this article :

https://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2017/09/26/open-letter-to-nfl-players-youre-being-used/

I think it makes perfect sense.

This is written by someone who has no idea of the Grassroots work,( with Money donated By CK himself ) to combat all the problems he wrote about. the Literacy Programs, Job Training and placement, anti gang initiatives...etc.... I wish these guys would take the time to actually get on the ground and actually see this work being done instead of going off media propoganda, and creating ill informed Blogs. Right now a  lifelong friend of my is spearheading an event called "24 Hours of Peace" in Newark NJ, for the 2nd year in a row, and  was even interviewed on ESPN NY about it this past week. that your Big Bro doesn't know about this doesn't surprise me.

This article reads like a Fox News Hit piece, the Police Departments around the country are supposed to Protect and serve ALL people, not cherry pick who they are going to Pull over, who gets approached with Gun Drawn, Who gets shot without provocation over who gets Negotiated with for Hours and Hours, while actually holding a weapon and waving it at police.

Former Tennis Star James Blake was Slammed to the ground and arrested standing in front of a hotel he was staying in, Eric Garner was choked Illegally and died for selling bootleg cigarettes, which should have gotten him a ticket at most. Walter Scott was shot in the back  several times while running away from a police officer, Laquan Macdonald was Shot 16 times, 15 of those after he was already on the ground from the first shot, and officers lied and said he lunged at them with a knife( lucky the dash cam was on this time)...and these are a few examples of Brutality CK protests, when in all honesty 1 should be to many, My commissioner always tells us as law enforcement we have to hold ourselves to a higher standard, shouldn't that also include uses of force? I mean Black people vote, pay taxes, and work ( yes, even in the DANGEROUS inner cities ) like very one else.

That's the Brutality the CK is protesting, that's why he kneels, Peacefully and non-violently, and excersing his constitutional rights...never once saying he was protesting the flag or the military....Only that Brutality and threat of it, which is something some of you guys will never experience and don't even try to empathize with ...and that is so Pathetic to me

That "brutality" you speak of isn't as prevalent an issue as you make it out to be. I agree, law enforcement can always do better, but they aren't out there gunning down black people at an exponential rate, versus the amount of whites/hispanics/asians they use deadly force against. That is a myth perpetuated by people like Kaepernick, and by Liberal media oulets like CNN.

Not " as prevalent an issue " to who sir? I don't even know why i'm engaging with you on this...
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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:02 pm


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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:42 pm

@BKAnthem wrote:

Not " as prevalent an issue " to who sir? I don't even know why i'm engaging with you on this...

BK, do you think only black people suffer injustice at the hands of cops? You don't think whites are roughed up or killed by cops? Sometimes unjustly?

All stats below are from the Washington Post tracker.

So far in 2017, 730 people have been killed by cops. Of those, 165 were black, 112 were Hispanic, and 326 were white. Of those 326 white people killed by cops, are we to assume every shooting was justified?

If you (not you specifically, but you in general) want to make the argument that there are bad cops out there and we need to do something about it, I assure you 90 percent of white people will agree. But when you make the argument that cops are hunting down and killing black people in the streets, and ONLY blacks are being killed, you're going to lose at least 50 percent of white people who know that isn't true.

Here's something else to consider. Even if you're 100 percent right and you want to persuade someone, you're never going to do it by insulting them. And that's where Kaepernick messed up. In order to bring about change, you have to first change people's minds. Insulting them and disrespecting something they care about usually isn't a good strategy.

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Last edited by Wallace108 on Wed Sep 27, 2017 11:36 pm; edited 2 times in total
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effyou515



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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:53 pm

@solardave wrote:
@Wallace108 wrote:
@solardave wrote:
My older brother ( some of you know how old I am and might think this is impossible) who is much smarter than me posted this article :

https://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2017/09/26/open-letter-to-nfl-players-youre-being-used/

I think it makes perfect sense.

Your brother says some unpopular things. But truth isn't always popular. He said a lot of things I agree with, and a few things I'm not sure about. I need to digest it a little more.

In the meantime, here's an article I believe everyone, regardless of their views, should read.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/ask-matt-labash-how-to-make-peace-over-trump-and-the-nfl-kneelers/article/2009833

Good post Wally. I think that in this information age we live in this information comes at us as fast or faster than we like and it makes it all the harder to think it through. And no matter which side of the fence we're on we still have to decide if what the "free press " prints is true.

The movie Absence of Malice with Paul Newman and Sally Field was a prime example of what the press is willing to do to sell papers. If you ever watched it you know Newman used their lack of integrity against them. A lot of people bash Trump for being on Twitter. This is the first time in my life that I've seen a US president be attacked relentlessly. Off of the top of my head I've been around for 13 of them. Yet because he fires back in real time a lot of people have their panties in a wad. If these people of the press can take pot shots then they should be ready for the recoil. Like the man said..."it's his right to be an asshole". Whether he should or shouldn't is debatable.

I think people in this information age like getting spoon feed what they want to hear we had a guy the last 8 years who was good at that.

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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 7:47 pm

Maurkice Pouncey: All Steelers Will ‘Do the Right Thing’ and Stand for Anthem

After skipping the national anthem ceremony last week, the Steelers intend to have every player on the sideline—standing—this weekend in Baltimore, Maurkice Pouncey told reporters Wednesday.

“Pittsburgh Steelers will go out there and do the right thing,” Pouncey said, according to ESPN.com.

https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/09/27/steelers-national-anthem-stand-maurkice-pouncey

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effyou515



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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 7:50 pm

@solardave wrote:
My older brother ( some of you know how old I am and might think this is impossible) who is much smarter than me posted this article :

https://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2017/09/26/open-letter-to-nfl-players-youre-being-used/

I think it makes perfect sense.

I live east of Atlanta, Ga. a lot of good black folks and a lot of black folks who have their own businesses or put in the time to go to school and work for a better life, its the ghetto mentality holding a lot of black folks back.

I've seen this with white folks, latino folks, Asian folks.

and the hate that someone else is doing better then them.

lets go to DeKalb county and do something stupid where the law is called those black police officers will give you a little beating when they get you to the police station they don't care what color you are but they deal mostly with black law brakers.

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effyou515



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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 7:56 pm

@Wallace108 wrote:
Maurkice Pouncey: All Steelers Will ‘Do the Right Thing’ and Stand for Anthem

After skipping the national anthem ceremony last week, the Steelers intend to have every player on the sideline—standing—this weekend in Baltimore, Maurkice Pouncey told reporters Wednesday.

“Pittsburgh Steelers will go out there and do the right thing,” Pouncey said, according to ESPN.com.

https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/09/27/steelers-national-anthem-stand-maurkice-pouncey

guess they are seeing the negativity from the people who spent the money so they can collect a pay check.

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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 11:34 pm

@Mach1 wrote:

Thank you for posting. I'd been curious what actual statistics looked like as this issue has been escalating of late.
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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Wed Sep 27, 2017 11:37 pm

@Wallace108 wrote:
@BKAnthem wrote:

Not " as prevalent an issue " to who sir? I don't even know why i'm engaging with you on this...

BK, do you think only black people suffer injustice at the hands of cops? You don't think whites are roughed up or killed by cops? Sometimes unjustly?

All stats below are from the Washington Post tracker.

So far in 2017, 730 people have been killed by cops. Of those, 165 were black, 112 were Hispanic, and 326 were white. Of those 326 white people killed by cops, are we to assume every shooting was justified?

If you (not you specifically, but you in general) want to make the argument that there are bad cops out there and we need to do something about it, I assure you 90 percent of white people will agree. But when you make the argument that cops are hunting down and killing black people in the streets, and ONLY blacks are being killed, you're going to lose at least 50 percent of white people who know that isn't true.

Here's something else to consider. Even if you're 100 percent right and you want to persuade someone, you're never going to do it by insulting them. And that's where Kaepernick messed up. In order to bring about change, you have to first change people's minds. Insulting them and disrespecting something they care about usually isn't a good strategy.

This is a great post...very well said.
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Wallace108

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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Thu Sep 28, 2017 12:02 am

@LambertWardSteel wrote:
@Wallace108 wrote:
@BKAnthem wrote:

Not " as prevalent an issue " to who sir? I don't even know why i'm engaging with you on this...

BK, do you think only black people suffer injustice at the hands of cops? You don't think whites are roughed up or killed by cops? Sometimes unjustly?

All stats below are from the Washington Post tracker.

So far in 2017, 730 people have been killed by cops. Of those, 165 were black, 112 were Hispanic, and 326 were white. Of those 326 white people killed by cops, are we to assume every shooting was justified?

If you (not you specifically, but you in general) want to make the argument that there are bad cops out there and we need to do something about it, I assure you 90 percent of white people will agree. But when you make the argument that cops are hunting down and killing black people in the streets, and ONLY blacks are being killed, you're going to lose at least 50 percent of white people who know that isn't true.

Here's something else to consider. Even if you're 100 percent right and you want to persuade someone, you're never going to do it by insulting them. And that's where Kaepernick messed up. In order to bring about change, you have to first change people's minds. Insulting them and disrespecting something they care about usually isn't a good strategy.

This is a great post...very well said.

Thank you.
------------------------------------------

The problem with the current movement is that it's built on a false narrative, which is driven by the media. Every time a black person is killed by a cop, CNN  (just to single them out) runs with the story for days. Out of the 326 white people killed by cops, how many received coverage on CNN? None that I can recall.

To illustrate that point ...
How many black men killed by cops in the past few years can you name?
Now, how many white men killed by cops in the past few years can you name (without assistance from Google)?

Anyone who isn't being intellectually dishonest can see the media's bias in coverage, which is intended to manipulate and help push an agenda.

Common sense, statistics, and facts (like in the Mike Brown case) prove that the narrative is false. That doesn't mean that there isn't a problem. There most certainly IS a problem. There are cases where people ... black, white, Hispanic, Asian, men, women ... are unjustly killed. But the problem is not going to be solved by pushing a false narrative that further divides people.

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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Thu Sep 28, 2017 12:40 am

At least they admit it


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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Thu Sep 28, 2017 4:17 am

@BKAnthem wrote:
@solardave wrote:
My older brother ( some of you know how old I am and might think this is impossible) who is much smarter than me posted this article :

https://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2017/09/26/open-letter-to-nfl-players-youre-being-used/

I think it makes perfect sense.

This is written by someone who has no idea of the Grassroots work,( with Money donated By CK himself ) to combat all the problems he wrote about. the Literacy Programs, Job Training and placement, anti gang initiatives...etc.... I wish these guys would take the time to actually get on the ground and actually see this work being done instead of going off media propoganda, and creating ill informed Blogs. Right now a  lifelong friend of my is spearheading an event called "24 Hours of Peace" in Newark NJ, for the 2nd year in a row, and  was even interviewed on ESPN NY about it this past week. that your Big Bro doesn't know about this doesn't surprise me.

This article reads like a Fox News Hit piece, the Police Departments around the country are supposed to Protect and serve ALL people, not cherry pick who they are going to Pull over, who gets approached with Gun Drawn, Who gets shot without provocation over who gets Negotiated with for Hours and Hours, while actually holding a weapon and waving it at police.

Former Tennis Star James Blake was Slammed to the ground and arrested standing in front of a hotel he was staying in, Eric Garner was choked Illegally and died for selling bootleg cigarettes, which should have gotten him a ticket at most. Walter Scott was shot in the back  several times while running away from a police officer, Laquan Macdonald was Shot 16 times, 15 of those after he was already on the ground from the first shot, and officers lied and said he lunged at them with a knife( lucky the dash cam was on this time)...and these are a few examples of Brutality CK protests, when in all honesty 1 should be to many, My commissioner always tells us as law enforcement we have to hold ourselves to a higher standard, shouldn't that also include uses of force? I mean Black people vote, pay taxes, and work ( yes, even in the DANGEROUS inner cities ) like very one else.

That's the Brutality the CK is protesting, that's why he kneels, Peacefully and non-violently, and excersing his constitutional rights...never once saying he was protesting the flag or the military....Only that Brutality and threat of it, which is something some of you guys will never experience and don't even try to empathize with ...and that is so Pathetic to me

OK you don't like Fox. Here's one from the Washington Post that supports both arguments.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/07/11/arent-more-white-people-than-black-people-killed-by-police-yes-but-no/?utm_term=.ef04005014bc
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Rick5895
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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Thu Sep 28, 2017 4:37 am

We have had a w/end of protests around the NFL. players refusing to stand for the anthem, entire organization locking arms and some not entering the field for the anthem etc. Prior to 2009 no teams were on the field for the anthem, they were in the locker rooms, this was paid for by the military to the NFL in a show of "patriotism"
Now folks are up in arms about players kneeling or standing, it's not about the flag but about social injustice present in all our societies. I have read a number of responses from U.S. Vets and they fight for freedom to civilians have the freedom to choose, that's whats happening here. But at what times do these protests become irrelevant. Professional athletes have a huge platform, look at what J.J. Watt accomplished, these men and women in our countries usually have leadership qualities or they wouldn't be where they are. I would suggest they use that platform to foster dialogue between Law Enforcement and community leaders to try to solve the issues and bring communities together. It won't be easy, in fact it'll be damn difficult, it will take decades not months or years, neither side really wants to listen to the other, it's easier to hate than work at resolving issues. But each group vilifying the other isn't helping and fosters hate and violence. If things don't change we won't have to worry about what the crackpot presidents from N.Korea and the US are doing we will implode from within.
Just one mans thoughts and rant.
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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Thu Sep 28, 2017 4:39 am

Not to mention the whole police brutality narrative being pushed by the alt-left conveniently forgets to mention any kind of statistics as to how many of the shootings were justified or not justified. I guarantee the percentage of shootings that occur that are't justified is an extremely small percentage (very likely less than 1%). But then of course when I make that argument, the predictable response is that the police protect each other, and the system protects the police... Nevermind things like evidence, facts, or due process. The Alt-Left only affords those luxuries to the criminals they worship.

@Rick5895 wrote:
We have had a w/end of protests around the NFL. players refusing to stand for the anthem, entire organization locking arms and some not entering the field for the anthem etc. Prior to 2009 no teams were on the field for the anthem, they were in the locker rooms, this was paid for by the military to the NFL in a show of "patriotism"
Now folks are up in arms about players kneeling or standing, it's not about the flag but about social injustice present in all our societies. I have read a number of responses from U.S. Vets and they fight for freedom to civilians have the freedom to choose, that's whats happening here. But at what times do these protests become irrelevant. Professional athletes have a huge platform, look at what J.J. Watt accomplished, these men and women in our countries usually have leadership qualities or they wouldn't be where they are. I would suggest they use that platform to foster dialogue between Law Enforcement and community leaders to try to solve the issues and bring communities together. It won't be easy, in fact it'll be damn difficult, it will take decades not months or years, neither side really wants to listen to the other, it's easier to hate than work at resolving issues. But each group vilifying the other isn't helping and fosters hate and violence. If things don't change we won't have to worry about what the crackpot presidents from N.Korea and the US are doing we will implode from within.
Just one mans thoughts and rant.

I agree both sides need to come together. The objective needs to be lowering crime in crime riddled areas, keeping kids off of drugs, out of dealing drugs, and out of gangs. If people would cooperate together towards a common goal it would go a lot further towards making society better. There would be less police shootings going on if there was less crime, and less people involved in criminal activities. Instead people just want to point the finger of blame at one lone thing, instead of trying to look at the bigger picture and the roots of the problem.

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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:15 am

@Rick5895 wrote:
Prior to 2009 no teams were on the field for the anthem, they were in the locker rooms, this was paid for by the military to the NFL in a show of "patriotism"
Now folks are up in arms about players kneeling or standing,

True, players used to stay in the locker rooms during the anthem. But now they're required to be on the field. There's a difference between not participating in something and showing disrespect to it.

And quite honestly, I don't think most people are really upset about the kneeling. Well, they are ... but it goes much deeper than that. I think a lot of people are sick and tired of having a false narrative shoved down their throats. People who are living paycheck to paycheck, who have busted their asses for what they have and are fighting to keep their heads above water are sick and tired of being told how easy they have it because of their white privilege. There's even more to it than that if we wanted to dig deeper. But people are fooling themselves if they think the anger is only about not kneeling for the anthem.

The anger and frustration we're seeing over the anthem ties into the same feelings that led a lot of white middle-class Democrats who voted for Obama twice to go out and vote for Trump.


@Rick5895 wrote:
it's not about the flag but about social injustice present in all our societies.

No, they've made it about the flag and the anthem. Let's say I wanted to protest something bad such as communism. So me and others started protesting at something that really has nothing to do with communism, something people care about and have deep respect for ... such as the MLK memorial on MLK Day. Do you think a lot of black people would be pissed off? Do you think they'd accept this argument: "Our protest isn't about MLK ... It's about the dangers of communism"?


@Rick5895 wrote:
I have read a number of responses from U.S. Vets and they fight for freedom to civilians have the freedom to choose, that's whats happening here.


Fair enough. But try telling that to other vets, such as my father, who was permanently disabled in the Vietnam War. He's a lifelong Raiders fan and hasn't watched a game since the kneeling began. This is a man who fought and sacrificed for his country. This is a man who struggles to do things you and I take for granted because he lost half his fingers on both hands when he was 19 years old fighting in a place most of us couldn't find on a map. The disrepect to the flag offends him greatly. Do you want to tell him and countless others like him that they're just being silly?

@Rick5895 wrote:
But each group vilifying the other isn't helping and fosters hate and violence. If things don't change we won't have to worry about what the crackpot presidents from N.Korea and the US are doing we will implode from within.

On this we can agree.

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PostSubject: Re: Villanueva, Steelers, and the anthem   Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:52 pm

@Wallace108 wrote:
@BKAnthem wrote:

Not " as prevalent an issue " to who sir? I don't even know why i'm engaging with you on this...

BK, do you think only black people suffer injustice at the hands of cops? You don't think whites are roughed up or killed by cops? Sometimes unjustly?

All stats below are from the Washington Post tracker.

So far in 2017, 730 people have been killed by cops. Of those, 165 were black, 112 were Hispanic, and 326 were white. Of those 326 white people killed by cops, are we to assume every shooting was justified?

If you (not you specifically, but you in general) want to make the argument that there are bad cops out there and we need to do something about it, I assure you 90 percent of white people will agree. But when you make the argument that cops are hunting down and killing black people in the streets, and ONLY blacks are being killed, you're going to lose at least 50 percent of white people who know that isn't true.

Here's something else to consider. Even if you're 100 percent right and you want to persuade someone, you're never going to do it by insulting them. And that's where Kaepernick messed up. In order to bring about change, you have to first change people's minds. Insulting them and disrespecting something they care about usually isn't a good strategy.

I'm 100% sure Black people aren't the only people that suffer injustice at the hands of police...But we have quite the long track record of victimization from it.

CK protests are about the fact that it seemingly hasn't changed much in all these years, because there actually was a time when Police/Sheriffs were hunting down and killing black people, especially in the south. It's not as prevalent as it was back then because of new civil rights laws, but that still makes some black folks more sensitive to it anytime it happens. That doesn't matter if your rich or poor, our history(Slavery,Reconstruction,Jim Crow) in this country leaves generational scars... no, wounds, that open up anytime we hear about an unarmed black man killed under questionable or flat out unjust circumstances....but what incenses me to no end are the people who start yelling about " Black on Black crime" or " No Dad in the Home", that's what we should be protesting, Like we aren't addressing these issues already, yes i take that personally.....or comments like there is no social injustice( Yet Mike Tomlin was just called a "no good N****" this week) .

Do you know how terrifying it is to be pulled over/Stopped by a cop? I've been held at Gunpoint, cuffed and made to sit on sidewalks, and been given bogus reasons the few times I've been given a reason at all for the stop, and I've had friends and male family members go through the same, so i come from a place of firsthand experience, and i work in Law enforcement now in spite of all that.

Protests aren't supposed to be convenient, and not all are popular....But we have a right to have them....I wasn't happy about White Supremacists marching in Charlottesville, but they have a right to do so as long as it's peaceful.

The fact that CK takes a knee doesn't stop anyone else from standing for the anthem, he's not hurting anyone or even interfering with their right to do so.....and like i wrote before, i see people doing things that would be considered even more disrespectful during the Anthem at games, but no one seems to want to focus on or even talk about that.

And lastly for the record...I have alot of successful Black friends who grew up with no Dad in the home...it's only a problem if you make it one.
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