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effyou515



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PostSubject: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyFri Jan 18, 2019 7:17 am

Cannot deny the negative impact Ben Roethlisberger had on team chemistry in 2018


As a young quarterback, he would clash with veteran wide receiver Hines Ward and anger his coach with misleading injury reports,

But as much as that article from 2015 would suggest Roethlisberger was a changed man, it is clear from some aspect of his behavior in 2018 that Big Ben is far from the finished product.

From making the team’s third round draft pick feel as unwelcome as possible just days after he was selected, to missing OTA’s because of a family holiday while rest of the team trained (with the exception of Brown), Roethlisberger was far from the leader you would expect for a player of his stature.

Critical of Le’Veon Bell for missing OTA’s in 2017, Big Ben’s decision to take a vacation just as they begun in June was not only hypocritical, but also directly responsible for the absence of AB. With Brown’s sudden disappearance starting the day after Roethlisberger missed his first day of practice, it was appeared obvious he believed that what was acceptable for his quarterback was more than good enough for him.

Given far too much leeway by the front office both on and off the field, it would be fair to say that Roethlisberger does not always set the best example for his younger teammates. Now seemingly provided a sympathetic offensive coordinator willing to let him throw the ball at will, despite leading the NFL in interceptions, it would be understandable if some of his teammates thought he was getting special treatment.

While some of his interception were directly responsible for a number of the losses the Steelers suffered in 2018, no one on the coaching staff did anything but support him publicly. A policy followed by the rest of the players on the roster. But when the shoe was on the other foot, Roethlisberger was not always so forgiving.

There can be no denying that Big Ben can be as critical of himself in public as he is on others, but he is also willing to give himself a break at the expense of others. It was interesting to note that of all the people he blamed for his game clinching interception against the Denver Broncos, the list somehow included Brown, Ramon Foster and Randy Fichtner and then him.

https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2019/1/15/18181446/cannot-deny-the-negative-impact-steelers-qb-ben-roethlisberger-had-on-team-chemistry-in-2018-nfl

Fans talking about the Steelers not winning another superbowl with Tomlin as headcoach I see it a little different the Steelers won't win another superbowl with Big Ben as the starting QB.

Imo you give BB free rein of the offense it shotgun and throw 15 yard plus down field all the time imo its BB putting the offense behind the chains most of the time. i can kinda see where AB is coming from I say drop the BB drama Queen and go with the young QBs. I think Fichtner was a great offense but it's BB holding it back. Imo you can bring in any OC as long as BB is the QB nothing will change.

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SteelerFreak58

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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyFri Jan 18, 2019 9:46 am

He definitely is part of the problem. His radio show needs to end. His accuracy has been a problem for a while now and his ability to stretch the field has diminished. I would love to see Rudolph get a shot but it’s not going to happen.

Emmanuel Sanders said it after he left who was the better QB and leader between him and Manning and he said Manning hands down no comparison. It pissed off Steelers fans but if you listened to why he said it and his reasoning you can now see most of it was true.
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Wallace108

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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyFri Jan 18, 2019 10:31 am

I've always referred to Good Ben and Evil Ben, both in his play and off the field stuff. As Steelers fans, we're biased. But there's a reason why everyone outside Steeler Nation doesn't think of highly as him as we do.

Here's a link to a good article by Paul Zeise dealing with both AB and Ben, with a sampling from the article ...

https://www.post-gazette.com/sports/paul-zeise/2019/01/17/Trading-Antonio-Brown-will-not-fix-or-come-close-to-fixing-the-Steeler/stories/201901170147

Brown doesn’t get the same pass on being a selfish player that Roethlisberger does. This is a subject that hasn’t been broached nearly enough, but we’ve started to hear from some of his current and former teammates that Ben is mostly concerned about Ben’s statistics.

It is also telling that he has been around for as long as he has and has only been named MVP by his teammates one time. This isn’t just a few disgruntled teammates with this perception, either, as this is seemingly well known around the league. The Athletic did a survey of 85 NFL players and one of the questions was “Which quarterback would you least want as a teammate?” Ben came in tied for second with Jameis Winston and behind only Cam Newton.

My point isn’t to take a hatchet to Roesthlisberger, it is to say people need to start being more honest with themselves about the Steelers and their problems.

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solardave

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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyFri Jan 18, 2019 2:32 pm

We are biased. I also think that Ben is an asshole. I have a Niece that was a manager at Louis Vuitton. She is friends with Troy and his wife. She knows Hines well and Jerome. She got my wife an autograph from Jerome. She's a manager at a different store now but is friends with Shazier. She goes to a lot of games and has a lot of insider information.

She's told me that "Hines is a womanizer". He'd hit on every woman in the store. I can kinda see that.
She says Troy's wife is a sweetheart and so is Troy nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason 1797695198
The Bus is a really great guy.
Ryan Shazier gave her 2 tickets to a game and met in where the players park so she wouldn't have trouble with security. But the one person she doesn't care for is Ben. She says he's rude and obnoxious. She's heard him tell kids to "get out of his face".

At this point now that no one who needs to is getting fired I'd just as soon see an open competition at QB next year. I mean for the starting job. I honestly believe if they hand it over to Ben he will be the reason we won't make the playoffs. Not because of diminished abilities as much as attitude. It really came out this year that he thinks he's the shit.

I'm sure he makes a point to get along with his o-line but even those relationships were tested on his radio show.
I also thought something was off with Washington. His body language when he didn't catch one was like it was all his fault but I watched Ben make some terrible throws and act like he should of had them. It's not like he can tell Ben to put the damn ball where I can catch it. My bold prediction. If AB goes Washington will be a viable #2 receiver for us. I'm saying he'll have a break out year unless Ben
treats him like a red headed step child again.
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nine vegetable



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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyFri Jan 18, 2019 3:35 pm

I would quote every one of you above if I could.

Why did we pass 45 times vs 17 runs against the Chargers? if you heard Belichik, he made it sound like it was junior high logic: they've put 7 DB's on the field all year long, its what they do. So of course you Run the ball. Simple.

Its because of Ben. HE wanted the throw it all the time - so that's what they did.

The team will never win until they are a TEAM. That means having a leader at QB.

Ben is NOT that leader.

Joshua Dobbs could be that leader if given the chance. Perhaps Mason could too, I just don't know him that well.

But until the QB is one who can bring the team together, not throw people under the bus, and work as a team - its not gonna happen.

Let the B's go - All of them. Ben - please retire. We won't win anything until you do.
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solardave

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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyFri Jan 18, 2019 4:35 pm

@nine vegetable wrote:
I would quote every one of you above if I could.

Why did we pass 45 times vs 17 runs against the Chargers?  if you heard Belichik, he made it sound like it was junior high logic:  they've put 7 DB's on the field all year long, its what they do.  So of course you Run the ball.  Simple.

Its because of Ben.  HE wanted the throw it all the time - so that's what they did.

The team will never win until they are a TEAM.  That means having a leader at QB.  

Ben is NOT that leader.  

Joshua Dobbs could be that leader if given the chance.  Perhaps Mason could too, I just don't know him that well.  

But until the QB is one who can bring the team together, not throw people under the bus, and work as a team - its not gonna happen.

Let the B's go - All of them.  Ben - please retire.  We won't win anything until you do.

We pretty much know Dobbs' character and the little I've heard about Rudolph has been good. Both hard workers. Both team guys. One of these 2 will be our future franchise QB. And I think either one will be a leader on and off of the field. I'm with you I think if Ben plays next year we're gonna wish he retired. I just have that feeling.
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Stella Nation

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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyFri Jan 18, 2019 4:35 pm

What I've been saying since the end of the season. Those who blame Tomlin (and I'm one of them) also need to blame Ben. He's selfish, disruptive, a bad leader and until last off-season he didn't take care of himself like a professional player should do. It's no coincidence that he missed so many games in the past and not a single one this year. That being said I want him to stay for at least another year and maybe even 2 because I believe it's to early for Dobbs or Rudolph to take over the starting job. I think it would hurt them more longterm than it would benefit them as they're not ready yet. And if I'm being honest I believe neither one of them is our franchise QB of the future. That doesn't mean they can contribute in the intervening period between Ben and our next GOAT.
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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyFri Jan 18, 2019 4:45 pm

I know a lot of you guys believe that Dobbs or Rudolph can be our next franchise QB and I think that the Steelers made the right decision to draft them but you've got to be realistic too, outside of Brady there aren't any franchise QB's drafted in round 3 or later in the NFL. Maybe Prescott, but he's more of the level of Andy Dalton. I think we can be happy if Dobbs or Rudolph ever reach that level.
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SteelerFreak58

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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyFri Jan 18, 2019 7:29 pm

Rudolph was slated as a possible 1st round pick by many of the top analysts so to say he may not be the next franchise QB is premature. He really hasn't had much of an opportunity to show his skill or talents and lets face it as long as Ben is around Tomlin will never give the kid a shot to take over like what happened in Baltimore.
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Master_Of_Puppets



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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyFri Jan 18, 2019 9:03 pm

has they traded up and got patrick mahomes like i wanted ,we wouldn't be having this discussion ... nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason 2625562446
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Wallace108

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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyFri Jan 18, 2019 9:48 pm

@Master_Of_Puppets wrote:
has they traded up and got patrick mahomes like i wanted ,we wouldn't be having this discussion ... nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason 2625562446

He'd still be sitting on the bench. nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason 273451046

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nine vegetable



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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyFri Jan 18, 2019 10:48 pm

@Wallace108 wrote:
@Master_Of_Puppets wrote:
has they traded up and got patrick mahomes like i wanted ,we wouldn't be having this discussion ... nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason 2625562446

He'd still be sitting on the bench. nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason 273451046

Wallace is right. Mahomes would still be a backup.

Here's a comparison:
Mason Rudolph, drafted in the 3rd round, 76th pick.
Russell Wilson, drafted in the 3rd round, 75th pick.

Dak Prescott, drafted in the 4th round, 135th pick.
Joshua Dobbs, drafted in the 4th round, 135th pick.

Of course, as we all know, Brady drafted much lower than any of them.

In the end, it really doesn't matter what round you're drafted in. Its what you do with your opportunities when given the chance. A high pick is given more leeway and wide open doors, but beyond that, they still have to prove themselves at some point (Blake Bortles come to mind?)

Me, I'm ready to give the young guys a chance.
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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyFri Jan 18, 2019 11:59 pm

salary cap wise it makes a lot more sense to keep AB and let BB go I think the Steelers could save something like 20 million on the salary cap plus having AB and JUJU as starting WRs would be help one of these young QBs as a starter then not having AB.

just think what kind of help the Steelers could get on defense with another 20 million on the salary cap.

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nine vegetable



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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptySat Jan 19, 2019 3:13 am

AB is a cancer, with or without Big Ben there. He would just continue to throw temper tantrums whenever he didn't feel the QB was throwing the ball his way enough.
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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptySat Jan 19, 2019 7:55 am

@nine vegetable wrote:
AB is a cancer, with or without Big Ben there.  He would just continue to throw temper tantrums whenever he didn't feel the QB was throwing the ball his way enough.

I have to wonder about AB and possible CTE. He's always been a little eccentric but it seems to have escalated the last couple of years. He has shown symptoms like aggression, acting out and erratic behavior. Time will tell. If this is CTE it won't matter where he goes he will be getting worse. From this point on I will be reserved with my criticism because if he is sick I don't want to have the guilt later and if it's something else I hope he gets help. I don't see AB as a bad guy. I do agree that his baggage is not something we need right now. I see Ben as an all about me guy just like we say AB is. I'm pretty sure AB will move on and all that will bring about is a spotlight on Ben and his selfishness.



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nine vegetable



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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptySat Jan 19, 2019 11:31 am

@solardave wrote:
@nine vegetable wrote:
AB is a cancer, with or without Big Ben there.  He would just continue to throw temper tantrums whenever he didn't feel the QB was throwing the ball his way enough.

I  have to wonder about AB and possible CTE. He's always been a little eccentric but it seems to have escalated the last couple of years. He has shown symptoms like aggression, acting out and erratic behavior. Time will tell. If this is CTE it won't matter where he goes he will be getting worse. From this point on I will be reserved with my criticism because if he is sick I don't want to have the guilt later and if it's something else I hope he gets help. I don't see AB as a bad guy. I do agree that his baggage is not something we need right now. I see Ben as an all about me guy just like we say AB is. I'm pretty sure AB will move on and all that will bring about is a spotlight on Ben and his selfishness.

 

I have to agree with you - it does seem that he's developed some issues, and if your suspicions are correct, that is very sad indeed.

However, from a team standpoint, he's still a cancer. He may not be able to help himself, but its still very destructive to the team, and I believe it would be for the Steelers going forward, if he were to stay.

On the other hand, Ben's just an ass.
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Master_Of_Puppets



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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptySat Jan 19, 2019 2:39 pm

@solardave wrote:
@nine vegetable wrote:
AB is a cancer, with or without Big Ben there.  He would just continue to throw temper tantrums whenever he didn't feel the QB was throwing the ball his way enough.

I  have to wonder about AB and possible CTE. He's always been a little eccentric but it seems to have escalated the last couple of years. He has shown symptoms like aggression, acting out and erratic behavior. Time will tell. If this is CTE it won't matter where he goes he will be getting worse. From this point on I will be reserved with my criticism because if he is sick I don't want to have the guilt later and if it's something else I hope he gets help. I don't see AB as a bad guy. I do agree that his baggage is not something we need right now. I see Ben as an all about me guy just like we say AB is. I'm pretty sure AB will move on and all that will bring about is a spotlight on Ben and his selfishness.

 

his attitude increased with his stats and salary. i'll take his team mates word on that. ryan clark says he made the call before brown got his big pay day ., that browns Diva personality was going to come out and he would eventually be a problem.
i'm paraphrasing here, but shannon sharp says wealth just amplifies the person you really are. in other words if you are an asshole, you will be an even bigger asshole when you get rich.

watch the video. brown even cussed out dick lebeau.
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Wallace108

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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptySat Jan 19, 2019 3:02 pm

@Master_Of_Puppets wrote:
@solardave wrote:
@nine vegetable wrote:
AB is a cancer, with or without Big Ben there.  He would just continue to throw temper tantrums whenever he didn't feel the QB was throwing the ball his way enough.

I  have to wonder about AB and possible CTE. He's always been a little eccentric but it seems to have escalated the last couple of years. He has shown symptoms like aggression, acting out and erratic behavior. Time will tell. If this is CTE it won't matter where he goes he will be getting worse. From this point on I will be reserved with my criticism because if he is sick I don't want to have the guilt later and if it's something else I hope he gets help. I don't see AB as a bad guy. I do agree that his baggage is not something we need right now. I see Ben as an all about me guy just like we say AB is. I'm pretty sure AB will move on and all that will bring about is a spotlight on Ben and his selfishness.

 

his attitude increased with his stats and salary. i'll take his team mates word on that. ryan clark says he made the call before brown got his big pay day ., that browns Diva personality was going to come out and he would eventually be a problem.
i'm paraphrasing here, but shannon sharp says wealth just amplifies the person you really are. in other words if you are an asshole, you will be an even bigger asshole when you get rich.

watch the video.  brown even cussed out dick lebeau.

I've seen lots of people suggest the CTE theory, stemming from the Burfict hit, but there's a thread here somewhere where I was saying that I feared him following the same path as Chad Johnson. I even referred to him as Ochoquatro. I don't remember when it was, but it was long before the Burfict hit. The signs were there early on, especially with his selfish celebrations that drew penalties, but we ignored them because of the talent. I remember the Chiefs game when he was screaming at Landry Jones when he wasn't getting the ball. Like I said ... the signs have always been there.

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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptySun Jan 20, 2019 4:03 am

Then maybe lots of money causes CTE these days. nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason 2087824411 I think that by the trade deadline our conversations about AB will be past tense but when preseason gets under way the Ben threads will be lit up. This may have been Ben's best season statistically and in a couple games it actually looked like he had this team on his shoulders but what did it get us. Frustration. If he can have a similar season next year minus the senseless INTs that would be great. I don't think Ben is going to stop forcing throws because Tomlin thinks "that's just Ben being Ben".

Look Ben being pissed about the Rudolph pick I have to think he saw him as a threat. I hope he is right or Dobbs is. Either one. Ben has done a lot for this team and belongs in the HOF but if they factored in leadership I think he would fall short.
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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyTue Jan 22, 2019 7:55 pm

I do think Ben needs to tone it down. Just go out, play ball, and have fun. I don't mind calling one's teammates out, there are times I believe that's acceptable but he has taken it a bit too far. I blame Tomlin more than anyone else for all of this. He should've put a stop to the social media, and media stuff a long time ago. No other coach in the league let's their players shoot their mouths off as much as Tomlin does. The lack of discipline off the field, then translates to the field.

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solardave

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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyWed Jan 23, 2019 4:25 am

@IowaSteeler927 wrote:
I do think Ben needs to tone it down. Just go out, play ball, and have fun. I don't mind calling one's teammates out, there are times I believe that's acceptable but he has taken it a bit too far. I blame Tomlin more than anyone else for all of this. He should've put a stop to the social media, and media stuff a long time ago. No other coach in the league let's their players shoot their mouths off as much as Tomlin does. The lack of discipline off the field, then translates to the field.

In the past we had Joey Porter and Greg Loyd running their mouths. Talking trash but they didn't bad mouth their team mates. I agree about calling out your team mates if it's to their face. I can't see where doing it on the radio or on social media serves any positive purpose. Call me old school but I feel like a leader talks things over in private and that's why I think a players only meeting to start. After that take your issues concerning anything Tomlin is or isn't doing to suit you as a team directly to him.


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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyWed Jan 23, 2019 10:24 am

Team Captains need to be the leaders. They need to set the tone and the expectations. They need to address issues with the staff and players and they need to do it privately. Tomlin needs to back up the Captains as much as possible.
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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyWed Jan 23, 2019 7:09 pm

Ben and Steelers enter contract extension talks.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwimrtuokIXgAhXFMd8KHUHBA3oQzPwBegQIARAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.espn.com%2Fnfl%2Fstory%2F_%2Fid%2F25835069%2Fsteelers-ben-roethlisberger-begin-contract-extension-talks&psig=AOvVaw0ZfC7Uf6oCyruSscedkWxF&ust=1548374950960863
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PostSubject: Re: nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason   nobody talking about Big Ben this offseason EmptyThu Jan 24, 2019 4:58 am

I don't claim to know what an extension would do down the road to our cap if he plays one more year and retires. I'd guess the dead money gets pushed to the future but would be lost.
I'd play the wait and see card until after next season. For 2 reasons.
1) To see if he's going downhill.
2) To let him know there are younger guys waiting in the wings to take his job if he continues to undermine the team.
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