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solardave
kirklandrules
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kirklandrules

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PostSubject: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptySun Dec 26, 2021 6:38 pm

There's been enough games to show a trend with this Canada offense. Unfortunately, that trend reflects something you don't see very often and that is an offense that has regressed with just about every game.

With Charlie Batch continuously mentioning in the SNR post-game shows that last year's offense was largely Canada's, it's now time to move on from this train wreck.

It's time to fire Canada and bring in a coach prepared for NFL level football.
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solardave

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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyMon Dec 27, 2021 3:06 am

@kirklandrules wrote:
There's been enough games to show a trend with this Canada offense. Unfortunately,  that trend reflects something you don't see very often and that is an offense that has regressed with just about every game.

With Charlie Batch continuously mentioning in the SNR post-game shows that last year's offense was largely Canada's, it's now time to move on from this train wreck.

It's time to fire Canada and bring in a coach prepared for NFL level football.

I agree and the keywords are "bring in a coach". I can understand our FA moves because of cap restrictions but there is no cap for coaches. The FO is just being cheap by promoting from within. They need to spend some money.
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IowaSteeler927

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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyMon Dec 27, 2021 4:14 am

I hate to be on a fire a coach bandwagon but I'm hopping on this one. Canada sucks, his offense is pathetic, and his situational playcalling is absolutely atrocious. I've seen enough from him to know I don't want to see him back.

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effyou515

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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyMon Dec 27, 2021 2:38 pm

Hard to call plays when your QB low accuracy with the medium and long passes an offensive line that pretty much sucks Ben only catches fire in the 2nd half when defenses are playing softer seen that against the Chiefs, the Chiefs defense didn't let up that much in the 2nd half.

let Canada live for another year. How to stop the Steelers offense? crowd the box send pressure and make ben beat you deep in Ben's younger days you could play that type of defense against him.

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Great Randino




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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyMon Dec 27, 2021 3:24 pm

There are no plays in the playbook that work if execution sucks.

I don't know if Canada should be fired or not. I certainly understand the push for it, as poorly as the offense has played.

In the back of my head, I can't get over the feeling that Ben has sabotaged his offense.

I also caught a sneaky reveal mid-game from Romo, who, whether you like him or not (and I do), knows the game inside and out.

He pointed out a screen play that Ben threw to the right. He said that Ben has an option on that play to go to the right, or throw to the receiver on the left. He pointed out that had Ben thrown to the left, its an easy first down and probably a touchdown.

Is it Matt Canada's fault when the QB makes the wrong decision? Of course not. I think we can all agree on that.

I'd he hesitant to fire Canada if for no other reason, that he deserves a QB who will get on the same page as him, and run the offense the way it is intended.

Again - on the fence with Canada. I certainly understand the desire by many to move on from him. But first, we move on from a QB incapable of making things happen in the first half and until garbage time.

I'll take it s step further. Ben should pull up stakes and call it quits Right Now. Of course he isn't going to retire with 2 games left. But he should be "injured" and not play.

This isn't going to happen, for obvious reasons. Steelers are still in the playoff hunt in the excruciatingly bad AFC North. "One More Chance"! although we all know the Steelers have No chance - even if we sneak into the playoffs somehow.
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solardave

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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyWed Dec 29, 2021 4:28 am

@Great Randino wrote:
There are no plays in the playbook that work if execution sucks.

I don't know if Canada should be fired or not.  I certainly understand the push for it, as poorly as the offense has played.

In the back of my head, I can't get over the feeling that Ben has sabotaged his offense.

I also caught a sneaky reveal mid-game from Romo, who, whether you like him or not (and I do), knows the game inside and out.

(He also said it's rare for a team to run like that on the Steelers. He must of missed the games starting last year)

He pointed out a screen play that Ben threw to the right.  He said that Ben has an option on that play to go to the right, or throw to the receiver on the left.  He pointed out that had Ben thrown to the left, its an easy first down and probably a touchdown.

(He was right there Ben missed that and he had time which is rare this year. I think it's shell shock. )

Is it Matt Canada's fault when the QB makes the wrong decision?  Of course not.  I think we can all agree on that.

I'd he hesitant to fire Canada if for no other reason, that he deserves a QB who will get on the same page as him, and run the offense the way it is intended.

Again - on the fence with Canada.  I certainly understand the desire by many to move on from him.  But first, we move on from a QB incapable of making things happen in the first half and until garbage time.

I'll take it s step further.  Ben should pull up stakes and call it quits Right Now.  Of course he isn't going to retire with 2 games left.  But he should be "injured" and not play.  

This isn't going to happen, for obvious reasons.  Steelers are still in the playoff hunt in the excruciatingly bad AFC North.  "One More Chance"! although we all know the Steelers have No chance - even if we sneak into the playoffs somehow.

I still think Canada needs to go because at the pro level you find a way to bring out the best in who you have. Has he done that consistently? I don't think so. Very little if anything has changed from Fitchner and he was fired. Rip the bandaid off is what I say.
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effyou515

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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyWed Dec 29, 2021 9:59 am

@solardave wrote:
@Great Randino wrote:
There are no plays in the playbook that work if execution sucks.

I don't know if Canada should be fired or not.  I certainly understand the push for it, as poorly as the offense has played.

In the back of my head, I can't get over the feeling that Ben has sabotaged his offense.

I also caught a sneaky reveal mid-game from Romo, who, whether you like him or not (and I do), knows the game inside and out.

(He also said it's rare for a team to run like that on the Steelers. He must of missed the games starting last year)

He pointed out a screen play that Ben threw to the right.  He said that Ben has an option on that play to go to the right, or throw to the receiver on the left.  He pointed out that had Ben thrown to the left, its an easy first down and probably a touchdown.

(He was right there Ben missed that and he had time which is rare this year. I think it's shell shock. )

Is it Matt Canada's fault when the QB makes the wrong decision?  Of course not.  I think we can all agree on that.

I'd he hesitant to fire Canada if for no other reason, that he deserves a QB who will get on the same page as him, and run the offense the way it is intended.

Again - on the fence with Canada.  I certainly understand the desire by many to move on from him.  But first, we move on from a QB incapable of making things happen in the first half and until garbage time.

I'll take it s step further.  Ben should pull up stakes and call it quits Right Now.  Of course he isn't going to retire with 2 games left.  But he should be "injured" and not play.  

This isn't going to happen, for obvious reasons.  Steelers are still in the playoff hunt in the excruciatingly bad AFC North.  "One More Chance"! although we all know the Steelers have No chance - even if we sneak into the playoffs somehow.

I still think Canada needs to go because at the pro level you find a way to bring out the best in who you have. Has he done that consistently? I don't think so. Very little if anything has changed from Fitchner and he was fired. Rip the bandaid off is what I say.

FIRE Canada!  3135543967 Same QB, Ben the graveyard of OC, love it 1 year on the job mofo already want to kick him to the curb. He took the job knowing the QB and o-line was toast.

imo it's going to be a ruff couple of years for us Steelers fans.

Hell it might be another 20 - 25 years before the Steelers get another franchise QB. FIRE Canada!  1797695198 FIRE Canada!  1689750825

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kirklandrules

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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptySat Jan 01, 2022 11:20 am

I mentioned this in another thread, but Charlie Batch stated on one of his post-game SNR shows that he had a conversation with an AFC coach who made it plain that the Steelers offense is very simple and teams have no issues game-planning against it. Take that into consideration when thinking through the Steelers offensive statistics that show they don't score on their first drives and in the last handful of games, can't score in the first half of games. Opposing defenses are shooting fish in a barrel.

There's zero imagination going into the offensive scheme. The reason the Steelers have no offensive identity is because the scheme is so easy to figure out, defenses are pitching complete shutdowns for 3 quarters of the games. Here's a recap of what the Steelers try to do on offense:

  • WR Jet - which really hasn't worked since week 3 and the Steelers have all but abandoned it. I'm not opposed to this play, but you need really good blockers to reach to the next defensive player and it's a difficult block to make. It works best when you get the defense to go in the opposite direction or suck into the middle (from some type of fake).
  • RPO - Here's a tip, NFL defenses figured out the RPO before they figured out the Wildcat. News flash, you're not going to win in today's NFL with RPO as your primary play set.
  • WR Bubble Screen - These were much more effective when the Steelers had JuJu. But they don't have WRs who can block, so these plays don't produce often enough to warrant calling them.
  • WR Goes - Just to be tricky and in an attempt to help produce better results on WR bubble screens, we have the outside WR Go. These have been effective on less than 50% of the attempts (I would wager it's closer to 30%) and have connected on 0 shots to Ray-Ray.
  • Good Ole Najee Check Down - When all else fails, dump it to Najee and hope he turns a 2 yard reception into a 10 yard gain.

The issue with that list of plays is a defense can easily defend again any of them with the same playcalls.

And, pray tell, how many times have you seen Freiermuth run a post? Or anyone run a post, for that matter? Everything this offense does is outside the hashes. Time and time again, I've seen defenses walk their safeties to the outsides prior to the snap. The middle of the field is left open even with 2 deep sets. Yet not a single pattern that runs to the deep middle of the field ... in several games! Don't get me wrong, I love the idea that you are stretching defenses across the entire field ... but if you don't take advantage of a spread-out defense by striking the middle of the field, then you can expect to fail.

When you consider the failures on offense are at the historic level, not just at a franchise historic level but a league wide historic level, coaching should be the top reason to list for said failures. Just imagine, this offense has failed where the Jags, Lions, Bengals, Browns, Colts (insert worst teams in NFL history) had not failed.

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solardave

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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyMon Jan 03, 2022 7:14 am

@kirklandrules wrote:
I mentioned this in another thread, but Charlie Batch stated on one of his post-game SNR shows that he had a conversation with an AFC coach who made it plain that the Steelers offense is very simple and teams have no issues game-planning against it. Take that into consideration when thinking through the Steelers offensive statistics that show they don't score on their first drives and in the last handful of games, can't score in the first half of games. Opposing defenses are shooting fish in a barrel.

There's zero imagination going into the offensive scheme. The reason the Steelers have no offensive identity is because the scheme is so easy to figure out, defenses are pitching complete shutdowns for 3 quarters of the games. Here's a recap of what the Steelers try to do on offense:

  • WR Jet - which really hasn't worked since week 3 and the Steelers have all but abandoned it. I'm not opposed to this play, but you need really good blockers to reach to the next defensive player and it's a difficult block to make. It works best when you get the defense to go in the opposite direction or suck into the middle (from some type of fake).
  • RPO - Here's a tip, NFL defenses figured out the RPO before they figured out the Wildcat. News flash, you're not going to win in today's NFL with RPO as your primary play set.
  • WR Bubble Screen - These were much more effective when the Steelers had JuJu. But they don't have WRs who can block, so these plays don't produce often enough to warrant calling them.
  • WR Goes - Just to be tricky and in an attempt to help produce better results on WR bubble screens, we have the outside WR Go. These have been effective on less than 50% of the attempts (I would wager it's closer to 30%) and have connected on 0 shots to Ray-Ray.
  • Good Ole Najee Check Down - When all else fails, dump it to Najee and hope he turns a 2 yard reception into a 10 yard gain.

The issue with that list of plays is a defense can easily defend again any of them with the same playcalls.

And, pray tell, how many times have you seen Freiermuth run a post? Or anyone run a post, for that matter? Everything this offense does is outside the hashes. Time and time again, I've seen defenses walk their safeties to the outsides prior to the snap. The middle of the field is left open even with 2 deep sets. Yet not a single pattern that runs to the deep middle of the field ... in several games! Don't get me wrong, I love the idea that you are stretching defenses across the entire field ... but if you don't take advantage of a spread-out defense by striking the middle of the field, then you can expect to fail.

When you consider the failures on offense are at the historic level, not just at a franchise historic level but a league wide historic level, coaching should be the top reason to list for said failures. Just imagine, this offense has failed where the Jags, Lions, Bengals, Browns, Colts (insert worst teams in NFL history) had not failed.


Stop the run,cover bubble screens and try not to trip over an Olineman on your way to pressuring/sacking Ben. Easy Peezy. What you said about Muth running a post is basic. Every team we've played this year their TEs have lived there picking our D apart. Yet Canada can't seem to understand if your QB doesn't have time to go long and your line can't run/pass block at least design plays that have a chance for success. Post or skinny post would have to have at least a chance compared to say... running outside on 3rd and 8 or 9 or a bubble screen thrown behind the LOS.

I can't defend Canada even if I wanted to. I said it before..this is the pros or as Jerry Glanville said "this is the NFL which stands for NOT FOR LONG if you keep making those kinds of calls". FIRE Canada!  1797695198
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Great Randino




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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyMon Jan 03, 2022 10:17 am

I totally respect the view of all of you guys on here regarding Canada.

I just can't understand why his offense is so predictable and easy to defend, when his offense in the past was not? I just feel like we are seeing a stripped down, vanilla version of that - or, possibly more accurately, something completely different.
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SteelerFreak58

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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyMon Jan 03, 2022 10:52 am

@Great Randino wrote:
I totally respect the view of all of you guys on here regarding Canada.  

I just can't understand why his offense is so predictable and easy to defend, when his offense in the past was not?  I just feel like we are seeing a stripped down, vanilla version of that - or, possibly more accurately, something completely different.

Your answer is.... Big Ben #7

There were multiple articles that have been put there where Canada, Ben, and Tomlin have admitted that Canada has had to tailor his offensive scheme to suit Ben's abilities, likes, dislikes, etc etc etc...

Pre-season articles, camp articles, early season articles. They never come right out and say it but the hints are there.

Canada's offensive schemes in the past require a semi mobile QB that can roll out of the pocket, do bootlegs, and can threaten a run. Ben can't do any of those three... NONE. So what is the end product? Well it's what Kirk posted a predictable series of plays where the Defense knows the QB is in the pocket and the front 4 need to only apply pressure. The Oline has trouble stopping the basic 4 rushers and the rest can sit back and pass protect. They stack the box on 1st and second down creating 3rd and 3+ and our Offense goes 3 and out on a regular basis...

All year long... Ben simply was/isn't the right fit for Canada's full offensive game planning. Now don't get me wrong I am not saying Canada is a genius but he was given a broken down old QB with very limited capabilities and a really shitty Oline and was told they should make it to the playoffs...

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Great Randino




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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyMon Jan 03, 2022 2:56 pm

@SteelerFreak58 wrote:
@Great Randino wrote:
I totally respect the view of all of you guys on here regarding Canada.  

I just can't understand why his offense is so predictable and easy to defend, when his offense in the past was not?  I just feel like we are seeing a stripped down, vanilla version of that - or, possibly more accurately, something completely different.

Your answer is.... Big Ben #7

There were multiple articles that have been put there where Canada, Ben, and Tomlin have admitted that Canada has had to tailor his offensive scheme to suit Ben's abilities, likes, dislikes, etc etc etc...

Pre-season articles, camp articles, early season articles. They never come right out and say it but the hints are there.

Canada's offensive schemes in the past require a semi mobile QB that can roll out of the pocket, do bootlegs, and can threaten a run. Ben can't do any of those three... NONE. So what is the end product? Well it's what Kirk posted a predictable series of plays where the Defense knows the QB is in the pocket and the front 4 need to only apply pressure. The Oline has trouble stopping the basic 4 rushers and the rest can sit back and pass protect. They stack the box on 1st and second down creating 3rd and 3+ and our Offense goes 3 and out on a regular basis...

All year long... Ben simply was/isn't the right fit for Canada's full offensive game planning. Now don't get me wrong I am not saying Canada is a genius but he was given a broken down old QB with very limited capabilities and a really shitty Oline and was  told they should make it to the playoffs...

I think that's an excellent, on-target description of the situation.

So tell me - why should Canada not be given a chance to run HIS offense next year - with a QB who will work with him and not against him?

I just think he's been put in an impossible situation.
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SteelerFreak58

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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyMon Jan 03, 2022 3:17 pm

@Great Randino wrote:
@SteelerFreak58 wrote:
@Great Randino wrote:
I totally respect the view of all of you guys on here regarding Canada.  

I just can't understand why his offense is so predictable and easy to defend, when his offense in the past was not?  I just feel like we are seeing a stripped down, vanilla version of that - or, possibly more accurately, something completely different.

Your answer is.... Big Ben #7

There were multiple articles that have been put there where Canada, Ben, and Tomlin have admitted that Canada has had to tailor his offensive scheme to suit Ben's abilities, likes, dislikes, etc etc etc...

Pre-season articles, camp articles, early season articles. They never come right out and say it but the hints are there.

Canada's offensive schemes in the past require a semi mobile QB that can roll out of the pocket, do bootlegs, and can threaten a run. Ben can't do any of those three... NONE. So what is the end product? Well it's what Kirk posted a predictable series of plays where the Defense knows the QB is in the pocket and the front 4 need to only apply pressure. The Oline has trouble stopping the basic 4 rushers and the rest can sit back and pass protect. They stack the box on 1st and second down creating 3rd and 3+ and our Offense goes 3 and out on a regular basis...

All year long... Ben simply was/isn't the right fit for Canada's full offensive game planning. Now don't get me wrong I am not saying Canada is a genius but he was given a broken down old QB with very limited capabilities and a really shitty Oline and was  told they should make it to the playoffs...

I think that's an excellent, on-target description of the situation.

So tell me - why should Canada not be given a chance to run HIS offense next year - with a QB who will work with him and not against him?

I just think he's been put in an impossible situation.

I would give him next year. I am not completely on board with him being fired. They need to address the Oline and give him a semi-mobile QB.

I would trade Chase Claypool for a high draft pick or bundle him in with a draft pick that is advantageous for us to move up or get a few higher round choices.

We need to pick up some more early round picks if that means moving back in round 1 for a later round 1 and possibly get an extra round 2 or 3 I would do it.

We need a true Center not a Guard that played 4 games in college at Center. Move Green to RG and put him on a Stength training program as soon as the season is over. I think Green struggling has been a major reason the Oline has been subpar.

Go out and pick up a FA QB that has some mobility and give him a chance in a full blown Canada ran offense. Then if there isn't improvement you move on. The organization really screwed themselves giving Ben that last contract big time and Canada really hasn't been able to do a lot of what he likes to do.

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Great Randino




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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyMon Jan 03, 2022 5:32 pm

What upcoming free agent QB's do you like? What's your opinion of Huntley?
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SteelerFreak58

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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyTue Jan 04, 2022 1:05 am

@Great Randino wrote:
What upcoming free agent QB's do you like?  What's your opinion of Huntley?

I like Huntley not sure he would be available but if he was I would give him a shot.

Marcus Mariotta could be one that fit Canada's needs and he will be in the market and cheap.

Any semi-mobile QB with decent accuracy that can naked bootleg, roll out of the pocket and can move in space and is a threat to get 1st downs with his feet gives you way more options then a static pocket passer.
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effyou515

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PostSubject: Re: FIRE Canada!    FIRE Canada!  EmptyTue Jan 04, 2022 1:15 am

@SteelerFreak58 wrote:
@Great Randino wrote:
What upcoming free agent QB's do you like?  What's your opinion of Huntley?

I like Huntley not sure he would be available but if he was I would give him a shot.

Marcus Mariotta could be one that fit Canada's needs and he will be in the market and cheap.

Any semi-mobile QB with decent accuracy that can naked bootleg, roll out of the pocket and can move in space and is a threat to get 1st downs with his feet gives you way more options then a static pocket passer.

with this o-[ine you'll need a track star. FIRE Canada!  1797695198

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